Name: From licence to longevity with Griffin
Uploaded: 2024-07-01T09:06:12.990Z
Duration: 836.8
Description: With a full UK banking licence recently secured, David Jarvis, CEO of digital bank Griffin joins FinTech Futures at Money20/20 Europe to discuss what this journey really took to achieve. In this video, Jarvis provides a full overview of the bank’s licence upgrade, its efforts to become fully operational, as well as its strategy for maintaining its Banking-as-a-Service division.

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{{00:00:08}}
Hello, everybody.

{{00:00:10}}
Welcome to Money 2020 Europe.

{{00:00:13}}
My name is Tyler Pathe.

{{00:00:15}}
I'm a reporter here at Fintech Futures.

{{00:00:18}}
And today I'm very excited to be
joined by Griffins, David Jarvis.

{{00:00:23}}
David, how are you?

{{00:00:24}}
I'm doing very well, Tyler.

{{00:00:25}}
Thank you for having me.

{{00:00:27}}
Thank you for joining us.

{{00:00:28}}
We are here, very early days
on Monday 2020, you're up day

{{00:00:33}}
one, first half of day one.

{{00:00:34}}
I'm already exhausted.

{{00:00:36}}
Me too I'm shattered, I'm
I can't wait for my bed.

{{00:00:40}}
First takeaways from, the first half
of day one what, do you think so far?

{{00:00:45}}
Oh gosh, I'm essentially just purely
reacting, I have a very, full diary

{{00:00:53}}
of meetings with Both investors,
but also potential customers

{{00:00:57}}
and the payments, wealth space.

{{00:00:59}}
It's hard to imagine a sort of higher
density venue and setting than this.

{{00:01:06}}
There's a lot of really good people
to speak to and we have one of

{{00:01:09}}
the best ones in front of us now.

{{00:01:11}}
So before we get going, we've
got some really good questions.

{{00:01:15}}
You've just finished your
licensing, really exciting.

{{00:01:18}}
You've got really good backers we're
going to talk about, but before

{{00:01:21}}
we do that, can you just give us a
brief snapshot of what Griffin is?

{{00:01:25}}
Yeah so we bank Fintechs.

{{00:01:28}}
So we are a fully authorized Bank
of England, PRA, FCA regulated bank.

{{00:01:34}}
And we provide safeguarding and client
money services to companies in the

{{00:01:38}}
payment space and the wealth space as
well as unregulated firms that maybe have

{{00:01:42}}
more complex payment automation needs.

{{00:01:44}}
As well as doing white labeled sort
of embedded savings propositions.

{{00:01:49}}
Very interesting.

{{00:01:50}}
And a lot of that provision that you spoke
about just then has really been fueled

{{00:01:56}}
by your regulatory licensing in March.

{{00:02:00}}
Congratulations.

{{00:02:01}}
Thank you.

{{00:02:01}}
I'm, sure in post edit they'll,
do some sort of like streamers

{{00:02:05}}
coming out or something, hopefully.

{{00:02:07}}
Probably not but that's a huge
achievement I remember reporting on

{{00:02:11}}
that at the time and oh well, done,
Griffin, because I've been following

{{00:02:14}}
you for a little bit can you tell us a
little bit about that sort of licensing

{{00:02:20}}
process, very long and arduous, I
imagine and, more importantly, what

{{00:02:24}}
advice you would give to other companies
that were looking to achieve the same?

{{00:02:28}}
Yeah, I jokingly often will
tell them not to do it at all.

{{00:02:35}}
There was an interview with the
NVIDIA CEO a couple of months ago,

{{00:02:39}}
and they asked him what advice
would you give to your younger self?

{{00:02:41}}
And he was like, if I was giving
advice to my younger self, I

{{00:02:43}}
would never have done this.

{{00:02:45}}
I, I didn't know how hard it would
be, and it is the sort of thing

{{00:02:47}}
that having gone through it, I would
never wish it on anyone ever again.

{{00:02:52}}
And yet we have gone
through it, and here we are.

{{00:02:56}}
In our case we knew from the beginning
that we needed to be a bank in order

{{00:03:00}}
to do the thing that we wanted to do.

{{00:03:02}}
And it was be a bank or nothing.

{{00:03:04}}
And it, on many, different occasions,
people pushed us to try to be something

{{00:03:09}}
else, and I am glad that we stayed
the course and really kept our focus.

{{00:03:15}}
There's a video from 2016, before we
even incorporated, where we were applying

{{00:03:20}}
to get into YC, and it's like a five
minute, it's it's embarrassing, it's like

{{00:03:23}}
me still in my flat in San Francisco.

{{00:03:26}}
And yet the pitch that I gave
then, sloppy though it is, of the

{{00:03:30}}
same business that we have now.

{{00:03:32}}
It's cool how little has changed.

{{00:03:33}}
Follow your dreams, you say and hopefully
you won't look back on this interview

{{00:03:38}}
in five years time with With, quite as
much embarrassment, but I had a, very

{{00:03:45}}
different haircut at the time, oh.

{{00:03:48}}
The haircut will at least be less
embarrassing this time around.

{{00:03:51}}
I got mine cut especially for
this for this conference here

{{00:03:54}}
today yes, I feel your pain.

{{00:03:57}}
In, in terms of, that, licensing journey,
Yes, you landed the full license in

{{00:04:04}}
March, but for just up to a year before
that you were operating on a a w a WR

{{00:04:13}}
authorized with restrictions license.

{{00:04:15}}
Yep.

{{00:04:15}}
How has the transition been for
you going from that a WR license

{{00:04:21}}
to a, full banking license?

{{00:04:25}}
Operating with authorization,
with restrictions, or in

{{00:04:29}}
the mobilization period.

{{00:04:30}}
was really crucial for us in terms of
signing our first cohort of customers.

{{00:04:36}}
So we ran a sort of pilot program
called Launchpad which we used to

{{00:04:39}}
sign eight customers that we are
in the process of taking live.

{{00:04:44}}
Some are live already.

{{00:04:46}}
And it was valuable in giving them the
confidence that we were authorized, right?

{{00:04:51}}
That we were going to overcome
the hardest hurdle, right?

{{00:04:55}}
The regulators don't want to give
you authorization with restrictions

{{00:04:58}}
unless they really hope and intend
for you to become fully authorized.

{{00:05:01}}
They do have some expectations for you
over that period but they, think on

{{00:05:07}}
balance, we have confidence that this
is a firm that will enter the market.

{{00:05:11}}
But of course, moving from that,
where you're selling, but you can't

{{00:05:15}}
really operate, certainly not at
any scale, to actually having to

{{00:05:19}}
operate at scale is very, different.

{{00:05:22}}
And mobilization is definitely still
a, it's a, transition period from

{{00:05:28}}
build mode to run mode, whereas now
we're very much in full on run mode.

{{00:05:33}}
How do we make this efficient?

{{00:05:34}}
How do we make this really
work as a commercial entity?

{{00:05:39}}
That is, really interesting to think
about, and that lead up process.

{{00:05:45}}
Do you think your standing as a
company has ultimately shifted for

{{00:05:48}}
the better because of the licensing?

{{00:05:50}}
Oh yeah we have no purpose
without a bank license.

{{00:05:54}}
We had one customer, and, it
was always for us about this.

{{00:06:03}}
And it's it's wonderful to
finally be where we wanted to be.

{{00:06:08}}
And then, of course, the next thing
one starts thinking about is all

{{00:06:12}}
of the things that you don't yet
have that you wish you had, Right.

{{00:06:15}}
I wish we had more international
payments, I wish we had card issuing,

{{00:06:18}}
I wish we had blah blah blah blah blah.

{{00:06:19}}
But now we actually get to go and pursue
those things, while having customers

{{00:06:24}}
and a viable business in the meantime.

{{00:06:26}}
That's, a very, good thing to hear
and, that you're in that mindset

{{00:06:31}}
of being a fully licensed bank.

{{00:06:34}}
The licensing is one very critical
aspect of, your product delivery,

{{00:06:40}}
by all means, But you are also quite
significantly backed we've got Mass

{{00:06:45}}
Mutual Ventures, Nordic Ninja, very
good name, and Brega, who I could

{{00:06:51}}
never remember how to pronounce.

{{00:06:53}}
You are leveraging quite considerable
funds and the support of your investors

{{00:06:59}}
at this time, along with your licensing.

{{00:07:02}}
How are you going to leverage those
funds to become a fully operational

{{00:07:05}}
bank, or how are you doing it right now?

{{00:07:07}}
very much.

{{00:07:08}}
Yeah, as I find myself briefing
investors at the conference

{{00:07:14}}
building a bank is not cheap and
running a bank is not cheap, right?

{{00:07:18}}
And yes, we have a team of 50 people on
the technology side, engineers, designers,

{{00:07:23}}
product people, but we also have 50
people helping us to run the bank across

{{00:07:27}}
finance, risk, compliance, operations and
those funds are there to help us run this

{{00:07:35}}
business while we scale revenue until
such time as we are a profitable business.

{{00:07:41}}
And how has it been to direct
those funds as the CEO?

{{00:07:47}}
I don't know.

{{00:07:47}}
It's every check you write is painful,
but also we have an incredible team.

{{00:07:52}}
The product we've built is
really, good, even though there's

{{00:07:56}}
so much more for us to do.

{{00:07:58}}
And yeah.

{{00:08:00}}
Yeah, I don't know.

{{00:08:04}}
I don't know that I have a
good answer to that question.

{{00:08:06}}
Oh we hope to see it.

{{00:08:08}}
We hope to see it very soon.

{{00:08:11}}
You've, got the support behind you now.

{{00:08:13}}
And that's really the most
critical point of this.

{{00:08:16}}
Yeah.

{{00:08:18}}
Moving then on to some of your
other part of Freemance and

{{00:08:22}}
services that you're working on.

{{00:08:24}}
You've got a foundations program, which
I was reading a little bit about online.

{{00:08:28}}
And I was, I mentioned it when I
was reporting on your licensing.

{{00:08:31}}
I thought it would be very relevant.

{{00:08:33}}
Maybe you can tell us a
little bit more about that.

{{00:08:35}}
Yeah when we went through AWR, we
ran this program which I've already

{{00:08:40}}
mentioned called Launchpad, which
was really successful for us.

{{00:08:43}}
And the thing that we did with
Launchpad was to look for companies

{{00:08:48}}
that really understood that they
would be design partners, right?

{{00:08:51}}
So they would be working with an entity
that was newly licensed, that was

{{00:08:54}}
really going to be doing quite a bit
of work and polish on the products.

{{00:08:57}}
Foundations is intended more for companies
that don't necessarily want to do quite

{{00:09:01}}
so much design partnering but also
recognize that they're going to be working

{{00:09:04}}
with a fairly early stage bank, right?

{{00:09:06}}
And so we're looking for companies that,
don't need to work with a Barclays or

{{00:09:11}}
a NatWest in order to be comfortable.

{{00:09:12}}
They're happy to work with a younger more
technology oriented entity but where we

{{00:09:17}}
might be, let's say, deploying a use case
that we already have solved for, right?

{{00:09:22}}
So we have two customers in the
salary finance space who are

{{00:09:25}}
both doing savings accounts.

{{00:09:27}}
So we're looking for kind of
repeatable cases where you can

{{00:09:30}}
deploy the same product into the
same sector, and build out a couple

{{00:09:35}}
of, yeah, really proven use cases.

{{00:09:37}}
That is very, interesting you, in terms
of your ventures in like Banking as

{{00:09:43}}
a Service you're a UK headquartered
company, founded in the UK, being quite

{{00:09:51}}
fresh in the space with your licensing,
Still maybe trying to find your feet as

{{00:09:57}}
a fully operational bank in that sense.

{{00:10:00}}
What do you think the challenges are
of operating banking as a service?

{{00:10:04}}
When we look at the market at the moment,
especially in the US we had a little

{{00:10:09}}
bit of a discussion before the camera
started rolling, but we were looking a

{{00:10:13}}
little bit like the Synapse sort of saga
that's going on in the industry right now.

{{00:10:18}}
And I'm sure by the time that this
gets published, I'm sure that it would

{{00:10:21}}
have all of, Flipped and twisted and
whatever it's been doing recently.

{{00:10:26}}
But what can you tell us about
the challenges of Banking as

{{00:10:29}}
a Service within the current
sort of wider global framework?

{{00:10:33}}
Yeah I think, again like we always had
this vision of building a bank and we

{{00:10:39}}
always had the conviction that you really
needed to be a bank in order to deliver

{{00:10:42}}
these services in a way that was reliable.

{{00:10:46}}
And I mean that across a sort of system
stability perspective, making sure

{{00:10:49}}
customers funds are protected managing
your financial crime obligations, and

{{00:10:53}}
what we've seen over the last five
years has been a huge number of people

{{00:10:56}}
trying to solve this problem without
going through that pain point and not

{{00:11:00}}
having the controls in place to make sure
customers funds are protected, to make

{{00:11:03}}
sure financial crime isn't happening,
and we've watched like a number of

{{00:11:08}}
these players die or explode or run into
regulatory issues over the last really

{{00:11:14}}
last 18 months, I think, in particular.

{{00:11:16}}
And the Synapse one, I think, is
probably going to lead to some pretty

{{00:11:19}}
substantial regulatory change, certainly
in the US and maybe even in Europe.

{{00:11:24}}
And it is a very On the one hand,
it's really validating for us.

{{00:11:29}}
On the other hand it is distressing
to watch, because at the end of the

{{00:11:34}}
day the people who are impacted are,
like, normal human beings, right?

{{00:11:40}}
Who trusted these, who trusted Fintechs
to keep their money safe, who trusted

{{00:11:45}}
platforms, and somewhere that broke down.

{{00:11:50}}
In terms of this sort of like trust
journey that you mentioned I think

{{00:11:53}}
it's so important when you're dealing
with, people's funds, their sort of

{{00:11:58}}
earnings, their savings, anything
like that, you've gotta have that

{{00:12:02}}
sort of trusted reputation, right?

{{00:12:05}}
Yeah.

{{00:12:06}}
It's, actually, it's really interesting
you say that, because one of the

{{00:12:08}}
things that we, used to talk a
lot about banks and trust, right?

{{00:12:13}}
And, particularly when we were
getting started we were still very

{{00:12:17}}
much in the hangover of the great
financial crisis, and people would

{{00:12:20}}
say but people don't trust banks.

{{00:12:22}}
They all think banks are
all evil and what have you.

{{00:12:24}}
And it's yeah, you don't trust,
interestingly, you don't trust banks

{{00:12:27}}
to behave ethically, but you do trust
them to watch your money, right?

{{00:12:30}}
And you trust them to watch your
money in a way that very few, you

{{00:12:33}}
trust very few other organizations,
and that's still true today.

{{00:12:36}}
Yeah, it's I was reading Leda Glyptis
book, Bankers Like Us, earlier this

{{00:12:45}}
year, and she's actually just been on
the stage talking about banks and trust.

{{00:12:49}}
Yeah.

{{00:12:50}}
And it was really, interesting, and
she didn't say it on the stage, but

{{00:12:53}}
in her book she was talking about this
This historic role that banks play

{{00:12:57}}
in keeping people's money safe as the
custodians of the world and providing

{{00:13:04}}
these services that people want, and
I think that what you touched upon is

{{00:13:08}}
yes, others have failed, but they have
not had the same regulatory standing as

{{00:13:12}}
Griffin, and it is something that you
fought hard to achieve, yeah the bar, is

{{00:13:19}}
higher, considerably and so maybe that is
some, a takeaway from this conversation

{{00:13:23}}
is that if you want to go higher.

{{00:13:25}}
If you want to go further in, in the
world of banking, then you really

{{00:13:29}}
have to play it by the book, which is
exactly what you did, and it paid off.

{{00:13:34}}
Let's, hope it will pay off.

{{00:13:35}}
It paid off with us getting authorized.

{{00:13:37}}
He has to be proven that we can
build a a highly successful business.

{{00:13:41}}
I think we can.

{{00:13:42}}


{{00:13:43}}
You can as well.

{{00:13:43}}
We can.

{{00:13:45}}
Us two together.

{{00:13:47}}
I yeah, looking at what you're doing right
now and what you've done and where you're

{{00:13:52}}
going, I think it's really, interesting.

{{00:13:54}}
But, David.

{{00:13:55}}
It's been a pleasure to talk to you today.

{{00:13:57}}
Thank you for having me.

{{00:13:58}}
I'm sure we'll see each other at some
point in in the madness of 2020, but thank

{{00:14:04}}
you very much everybody who's followed
along online on our website and socials.

{{00:14:09}}
If you would like to find out any more
information about Griffin, Money 2020,

{{00:14:15}}
or the Fintech world in general, please
head over to our website Fintechfutures.

{{00:14:21}}
com.

{{00:14:21}}
Until next time, my name has
been Tyler Pave, and I've

{{00:14:26}}
enjoyed this interview very much.

{{00:14:27}}
Thank you.

And today I'm very excited to be
joined by Griffins, David Jarvis.

We are here, very early days
on Monday 2020, you're up day

Me too I'm shattered, I'm
I can't wait for my bed.

First takeaways from, the first half
of day one what, do you think so far?

Oh gosh, I'm essentially just purely
reacting, I have a very, full diary

of meetings with Both investors,
but also potential customers

It's hard to imagine a sort of higher
density venue and setting than this.

There's a lot of really good people
to speak to and we have one of

So before we get going, we've
got some really good questions.

You've just finished your
licensing, really exciting.

You've got really good backers we're
going to talk about, but before

we do that, can you just give us a
brief snapshot of what Griffin is?

So we are a fully authorized Bank
of England, PRA, FCA regulated bank.

And we provide safeguarding and client
money services to companies in the

payment space and the wealth space as
well as unregulated firms that maybe have

As well as doing white labeled sort
of embedded savings propositions.

And a lot of that provision that you spoke
about just then has really been fueled

I'm, sure in post edit they'll,
do some sort of like streamers

Probably not but that's a huge
achievement I remember reporting on

that at the time and oh well, done,
Griffin, because I've been following

you for a little bit can you tell us a
little bit about that sort of licensing

process, very long and arduous, I
imagine and, more importantly, what

advice you would give to other companies
that were looking to achieve the same?

Yeah, I jokingly often will
tell them not to do it at all.

There was an interview with the
NVIDIA CEO a couple of months ago,

and they asked him what advice
would you give to your younger self?

And he was like, if I was giving
advice to my younger self, I

I, I didn't know how hard it would
be, and it is the sort of thing

that having gone through it, I would
never wish it on anyone ever again.

And yet we have gone
through it, and here we are.

In our case we knew from the beginning
that we needed to be a bank in order

And it, on many, different occasions,
people pushed us to try to be something

else, and I am glad that we stayed
the course and really kept our focus.

There's a video from 2016, before we
even incorporated, where we were applying

to get into YC, and it's like a five
minute, it's it's embarrassing, it's like

And yet the pitch that I gave
then, sloppy though it is, of the

Follow your dreams, you say and hopefully
you won't look back on this interview

in five years time with With, quite as
much embarrassment, but I had a, very

The haircut will at least be less
embarrassing this time around.

I got mine cut especially for
this for this conference here

In, in terms of, that, licensing journey,
Yes, you landed the full license in

March, but for just up to a year before
that you were operating on a a w a WR

How has the transition been for
you going from that a WR license

Operating with authorization,
with restrictions, or in

was really crucial for us in terms of
signing our first cohort of customers.

So we ran a sort of pilot program
called Launchpad which we used to

sign eight customers that we are
in the process of taking live.

And it was valuable in giving them the
confidence that we were authorized, right?

That we were going to overcome
the hardest hurdle, right?

The regulators don't want to give
you authorization with restrictions

unless they really hope and intend
for you to become fully authorized.

They do have some expectations for you
over that period but they, think on

balance, we have confidence that this
is a firm that will enter the market.

But of course, moving from that,
where you're selling, but you can't

really operate, certainly not at
any scale, to actually having to

And mobilization is definitely still
a, it's a, transition period from

build mode to run mode, whereas now
we're very much in full on run mode.

How do we make this really
work as a commercial entity?

That is, really interesting to think
about, and that lead up process.

Do you think your standing as a
company has ultimately shifted for

Oh yeah we have no purpose
without a bank license.

We had one customer, and, it
was always for us about this.

And it's it's wonderful to
finally be where we wanted to be.

And then, of course, the next thing
one starts thinking about is all

of the things that you don't yet
have that you wish you had, Right.

FinTech Futures

Expert Insight

With a full UK banking licence recently secured, David Jarvis, CEO of digital bank Griffin joins FinTech Futures at Money20/20 Europe to discuss what this journey really took to achieve. In this video, Jarvis provides a full overview of the bank’s licence upgrade, its efforts to become fully operational, as well as its strategy for maintaining its Banking-as-a-Service division.