Name: Standard Chartered at Sibos 2023 – ISO 20022 and the push for global adoption
Uploaded: 2023-10-03T15:07:10.561Z
Duration: 766.43
Description: At the Sibos 2023 conference in Toronto, FinTech Futures sat down with David Rego, Global Head of Payments at Standard Chartered, to discuss how much progress has been made globally with the switch to ISO 20022 and some of the key benefits of the standard for corporates.

05-David Rego.mp4

05-David Rego.vtt

ENGLISH

{{00:00:06}}
This is Fintech

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Futures at Sibos and I'm

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joined

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by David Rego of Standard

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Chartered.

{{00:00:10}}
David, thank you so much for taking
the time out to speak with us.

{{00:00:12}}
Just get started.

{{00:00:13}}
I'd like to give us a quick introduction
to yourself and your role in it.

{{00:00:15}}
Thank you, Paul.

{{00:00:16}}
Very happy to be here.

{{00:00:18}}
My full name

{{00:00:19}}
is David Rego, Standard

{{00:00:20}}
Chartered Bank I'm based out of Singapore.

{{00:00:24}}
I head our global payments product which
covers all segments, FI, corporate,

{{00:00:29}}
big, large, small and our platform also
services our retail business as well.

{{00:00:36}}
Excellent.

{{00:00:36}}
And you're here, going to be on a panel
discussing ISO 20022 extending the

{{00:00:41}}
potential benefits line to corporates.

{{00:00:43}}
For those not in attendance, can you give
us a quick rundown of that, some of the

{{00:00:45}}
key takeaways maybe from that discussion?

{{00:00:46}}
Yeah, so we actually had a panel
discussion this morning on the topic

{{00:00:50}}
and admittedly there is limited
uptake at this point in time.

{{00:00:57}}
There's about, only about 15
percent or so of messages that are

{{00:01:01}}
actually flowing over ISO 20022
standards over the past six months.

{{00:01:06}}
Obviously, we see that picking up there's
challenges with the community, with banks

{{00:01:12}}
adopting it and picking that up as well.

{{00:01:15}}
But.

{{00:01:17}}
On the whole, I would say as we went
through the discussion, it's quite

{{00:01:21}}
clear that it is an initiative that we
need to adopt and drive as a community.

{{00:01:26}}
We need to also bring in corporates into
this journey because they're ultimately

{{00:01:30}}
the ones who instruct us to pay.

{{00:01:33}}
And then have to have all the statement
information back so that they can

{{00:01:36}}
do the activities they need to do on
cash application and stuff like that.

{{00:01:41}}
Which means we therefore need to now get
much more engaged with corporates and

{{00:01:46}}
their system providers, which is, ERPs and
TMS providers, because that's the entire

{{00:01:54}}
community that you need to bring along.

{{00:01:57}}
Once we get that going, that's when
we start getting the rich data in,

{{00:02:00}}
that's when we get the structured
data in, that's when banks benefit

{{00:02:04}}
from a number of operational
efficiencies that they can achieve.

{{00:02:08}}
Much more efficient risk management,
but there's also corporate benefits

{{00:02:12}}
that could be realized because
they would get richer data for

{{00:02:16}}
them to work on, apply funds, etc.

{{00:02:20}}
Payments become faster because you
take friction out of the system

{{00:02:23}}
with inadequate and faulty data.

{{00:02:26}}
Payments flow faster, there's less stops
in the cycle and then there's a host of

{{00:02:31}}
other benefits that come through around
compliance control even for corporates.

{{00:02:36}}
For example we bank a number of NBFIs in
a number of markets, and in many of those

{{00:02:43}}
markets, these NBFIs are required to Make
sure that the deposits that come into

{{00:02:48}}
the accounts from their retail clients
actually come in from an account that

{{00:02:52}}
is in the same name as what they have on
their record, which today is being done

{{00:02:56}}
through all type of convoluted processes
because we don't really have those fields.

{{00:03:02}}
We don't have that level of
information in the payment

{{00:03:04}}
instruction that comes through.

{{00:03:06}}
For that, for corporates, it could be
that, it could be looking at things

{{00:03:09}}
around supply chain financing with the
remittance information that's available

{{00:03:13}}
with the new payment message format.

{{00:03:16}}
There's things around Poborobo, so
that's payments on behalf, receivables

{{00:03:20}}
on behalf, because there are dedicated
fields again in the ISO 20022 format.

{{00:03:25}}
I think for corporates as well, there's
significant benefits to be gained.

{{00:03:31}}
But it is all going to start with, the
banking community, the ARP TMS providers,

{{00:03:37}}
and the corporates working together.

{{00:03:39}}
Up until this point in time,
it's probably been just really

{{00:03:41}}
the banks working on this.

{{00:03:44}}
Sure, Excellent.

{{00:03:45}}
I know in the UK specifically, there's
been a lot of movement towards ISO 20022.

{{00:03:50}}
With November 2025 being the,
almost the end of that coexistence

{{00:03:55}}
period, how do you think progress
has been in terms of transition

{{00:03:58}}
globally towards that protocol then?

{{00:04:00}}
And do you think there's enough time
left for everyone to get over it?

{{00:04:03}}
Yeah, so that's...

{{00:04:04}}
That's indeed a very fair question,
Paul which also came up this morning.

{{00:04:09}}
So what we're seeing is UK is just one
of the countries that's gone on to ISO

{{00:04:17}}
200224 high value payments in the country.

{{00:04:20}}
There's a number of those
there's Australia, Singapore,

{{00:04:22}}
there's Canada, and the U.

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S.

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will happen on chips April of next year.

{{00:04:29}}
In 2025, Fed will also go to ISO 20022.

{{00:04:32}}
So I think most of the large domestic
systems will go on to the ISO 20022

{{00:04:37}}
format, which means in some shape and
form, a number of banks in those countries

{{00:04:41}}
need to necessarily comply and do it.

{{00:04:44}}
So we will see more momentum picking
up and more and more banks doing this.

{{00:04:50}}
The challenge is on the cross border side.

{{00:04:51}}
Are they doing it enough?

{{00:04:52}}
So in the sense are banks only solving
for this for domestic payments and not

{{00:04:57}}
looking at it when they do cross border
which obviously is not what we want.

{{00:05:01}}
We want the whole payment landscape
to be moving to the ISO 20022 format.

{{00:05:06}}
So I think there are challenges.

{{00:05:09}}
I think the timeline is I must say,
maybe even looking short, because I know

{{00:05:14}}
for a fact in Asia, we have quite a few
countries and banks from those countries

{{00:05:18}}
that are not necessarily doing it.

{{00:05:20}}
They're using things like
translators and other stopgap

{{00:05:23}}
arrangements to make this happen.

{{00:05:27}}
We're seeing progress, but I think it
really needs to pick up in order to

{{00:05:30}}
meet the 25 timeline for cross border.

{{00:05:33}}
I think on the domestic side, we clearly
see all banks having to play ball and

{{00:05:37}}
do that because that's their local
regulator and they need to make it happen.

{{00:05:41}}
Yeah on that front as well what
does the shift over to ISO 20022

{{00:05:45}}
mean for cross border payments,
do you think, going forward?

{{00:05:49}}
As I stated at the outset, I think
the benefits are significant.

{{00:05:52}}
What we also see is benefits that can
come from a number of our corporate

{{00:05:59}}
clients large and small, are moving
to digital commerce business models.

{{00:06:04}}
With something like ISO 20022, which
gives you a standard that can work for

{{00:06:10}}
cross border payments and A number of
these corporations in even small medium

{{00:06:16}}
enterprises are trading cross modal.

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If you have a format that allows you to
plug into your e commerce platform, the

{{00:06:23}}
payments format as well, it gives you
many more efficiencies that you can,

{{00:06:29}}
gain from connecting that commercial
transaction information from the...

{{00:06:34}}
ecommerce platform, sucking that
up, putting it onto a payment

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message, and then sending that out.

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And, the ISO 20022 format
allows for different syntax

{{00:06:44}}
like XML, JSON, and the like.

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So I think there, there are some serious
benefits to be gained as you go further

{{00:06:51}}
down the road from people who early adopt
and look at this and, bank with the banks

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that are doing this as well on a basis.

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So that whole cross border commerce
flow happening in the digital realm can

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really benefit from something like this.

{{00:07:09}}
Excellent.

{{00:07:09}}
I'm looking at payments
more in general terms.

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What are some of the key
trends that you've noticed in

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digital payments at the moment?

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I think the whole digital commerce
thing has, is post pandemic, it's very

{{00:07:20}}
clear that more and more corporations
are going to be moving their, workflows

{{00:07:25}}
for buying and selling online.

{{00:07:29}}
It's tended to be predominantly
domestic flows, but we now, it's

{{00:07:33}}
going to see the cross border flows,
like I mentioned that's one bit.

{{00:07:39}}
Digital payments is been around, for
example, in Asia a very long way there's

{{00:07:44}}
e wallets and the like, where people
either pay or collect into an e wallet.

{{00:07:48}}
So we see more of that happening.

{{00:07:51}}
There's obviously a lot of discussion
on doing payments through distributed

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ledger technology on the blockchain.

{{00:07:58}}
You've also got then the whole CBDC
engagements that are going on in

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multiple countries, which are in some
cases already live, domestic but then

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extending to cross border as well.

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So there's a lot going on.

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There's a lot that's in pilot stage
but as a bank that is operating in

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many markets we need to be engaged
and making sure that we are relevant

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to our clients and therefore.

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Saying, staying close to many of these
programs of work that are ongoing

{{00:08:28}}
and, taking the lead from how does
it really solve for a client's need.

{{00:08:33}}
And you mentioned DLT there.

{{00:08:35}}
Payments tokenization has been
getting a lot of traction as

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well recently in the headlines.

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What's, your take on that as well?

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Do you see that getting a bit more?

{{00:08:41}}
Yeah, so I think, at this point in
time, Paul, it seems to be a multiple,

{{00:08:47}}
sets of closed loop type systems
that are running on these tokens

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and I think getting it to be more
open is where the real challenge is.

{{00:08:58}}
I think the regulations are
still developing around that,

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so that's obviously going to
take some time to, to firm up.

{{00:09:04}}
As I mentioned the CBDC, again, the
Central Bank Digital Currency, again,

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the similar tokenized payment platform.

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How is that going to shape up?

{{00:09:14}}
Is that really just a
domestic cross border?

{{00:09:17}}
So I think it's really the use cases
are there, but I think people are

{{00:09:22}}
struggling on how you actually manage
that liquidity in an open ecosystem.

{{00:09:27}}
Whereas right now it tends
to be largely a tokenized

{{00:09:36}}
basis.

{{00:09:37}}
but it is just restricted
to that closed ecosystem.

{{00:09:42}}
But that's where the work we're doing with
Partio or the work we're doing with the

{{00:09:46}}
central banks around digital currencies,
I think eventually will lead to something

{{00:09:49}}
which creates that open ecosystem.

{{00:09:52}}
Maybe, if not entirely global.

{{00:09:54}}
Certainly on a regional basis there
is, every chance of that happening.

{{00:09:58}}
Excellent Given the rapid pace of change
with digitization new use cases coming

{{00:10:03}}
along, new companies popping up, how
difficult is it for, banks of all sizes

{{00:10:08}}
to keep up with that rate of change
and make sure that you're constantly at

{{00:10:10}}
the cutting edge of the technology when
it comes to payments or anything else?

{{00:10:13}}
We are challenged, like most other
banks, with a lot of spend on actually

{{00:10:17}}
regulatory upgrades that we need to do.

{{00:10:19}}
So that is clearly a big part of our
investment dollars goes towards that.

{{00:10:24}}
But I think the important thing,
Paul, is around picking the

{{00:10:27}}
use cases you want to go after.

{{00:10:28}}
Because there's lots of bright, shiny
ideas that, that come out ever so often.

{{00:10:35}}
It's really picking the ones that you can
take with a client and that you can scale.

{{00:10:40}}
with many more clients or that you are
going to do with a client that you believe

{{00:10:44}}
has that scale to, to create the value
that you've put into the investment

{{00:10:50}}
to create that use case for them.

{{00:10:52}}
So I think banks need to
be selective around that.

{{00:10:55}}
As much as I said, Previously, we need
to engage in the things like CBDCs and

{{00:10:59}}
those type of regulatory engagements.

{{00:11:01}}
When it comes to certain use cases,
we need to be far more precise

{{00:11:04}}
around the ones we want to go after.

{{00:11:06}}
And there is only limited investment
dollars that every organization has,

{{00:11:10}}
so we need to work through that.

{{00:11:12}}
Excellent, excellent.

{{00:11:13}}
And just to finish off then how do
you see the payment space evolving

{{00:11:16}}
in the near term future then?

{{00:11:17}}
Is there anything else that you've
got at Standard Chartered that you

{{00:11:19}}
can tell us about on the platform?

{{00:11:21}}
We're working on a few things.

{{00:11:22}}
Partio is one of them.

{{00:11:23}}
We're also working on
a solution we call...

{{00:11:26}}
Payouts as a Service, which in the
e commerce space allows us to split

{{00:11:30}}
payments based on rules, where if a
commercial transaction has happened

{{00:11:35}}
and there's different parties involved,
there's the buyer seller, there may

{{00:11:40}}
be a delivery agent, there may be
an insurance agent, there may be

{{00:11:43}}
other parties in the chain, once the
money is collected from the buyer.

{{00:11:49}}
How do you split that out on a rules
based engine, and then pay that out

{{00:11:54}}
to the different parties involved,
pay that out at a frequency that is

{{00:11:58}}
relevant for each of them, or a payment
type that is relevant for each of them.

{{00:12:02}}
We have an offering that's now live in
five markets called Payouts as a Service,

{{00:12:06}}
which really allows our clients to achieve
that efficiency and doesn't require them

{{00:12:11}}
to create all that code and, programming
and operations work on their side.

{{00:12:16}}
Because they just set up the
rules for the parties involved

{{00:12:19}}
in the commercial transaction.

{{00:12:21}}
And once that's set up, then we
just do all the work for them.

{{00:12:26}}
So that's, one of the issues.

{{00:12:27}}
There's a few others that we're
working on, but this one I believe

{{00:12:30}}
is going to be quite powerful from
the whole digital commerce space.

{{00:12:35}}
Excellent.

{{00:12:35}}
Thank you so much again, David,
for taking the time out to speak.

{{00:12:38}}
It's been a pleasure.

{{00:12:39}}
Thank you so much.

{{00:12:39}}
Thank you.

David, thank you so much for taking
the time out to speak with us.

I'd like to give us a quick introduction
to yourself and your role in it.

Chartered Bank I'm based out of Singapore.

I head our global payments product which
covers all segments, FI, corporate,

big, large, small and our platform also
services our retail business as well.

And you're here, going to be on a panel
discussing ISO 20022 extending the

For those not in attendance, can you give
us a quick rundown of that, some of the

key takeaways maybe from that discussion?

Yeah, so we actually had a panel
discussion this morning on the topic

and admittedly there is limited
uptake at this point in time.

There's about, only about 15
percent or so of messages that are

actually flowing over ISO 20022
standards over the past six months.

Obviously, we see that picking up there's
challenges with the community, with banks

On the whole, I would say as we went
through the discussion, it's quite

clear that it is an initiative that we
need to adopt and drive as a community.

We need to also bring in corporates into
this journey because they're ultimately

And then have to have all the statement
information back so that they can

do the activities they need to do on
cash application and stuff like that.

Which means we therefore need to now get
much more engaged with corporates and

their system providers, which is, ERPs and
TMS providers, because that's the entire

Once we get that going, that's when
we start getting the rich data in,

that's when we get the structured
data in, that's when banks benefit

from a number of operational
efficiencies that they can achieve.

Much more efficient risk management,
but there's also corporate benefits

that could be realized because
they would get richer data for

Payments become faster because you
take friction out of the system

Payments flow faster, there's less stops
in the cycle and then there's a host of

other benefits that come through around
compliance control even for corporates.

For example we bank a number of NBFIs in
a number of markets, and in many of those

markets, these NBFIs are required to Make
sure that the deposits that come into

the accounts from their retail clients
actually come in from an account that

is in the same name as what they have on
their record, which today is being done

through all type of convoluted processes
because we don't really have those fields.

We don't have that level of
information in the payment

For that, for corporates, it could be
that, it could be looking at things

around supply chain financing with the
remittance information that's available

There's things around Poborobo, so
that's payments on behalf, receivables

on behalf, because there are dedicated
fields again in the ISO 20022 format.

I think for corporates as well, there's
significant benefits to be gained.

But it is all going to start with, the
banking community, the ARP TMS providers,

Up until this point in time,
it's probably been just really

I know in the UK specifically, there's
been a lot of movement towards ISO 20022.

With November 2025 being the,
almost the end of that coexistence

period, how do you think progress
has been in terms of transition

And do you think there's enough time
left for everyone to get over it?

That's indeed a very fair question,
Paul which also came up this morning.

So what we're seeing is UK is just one
of the countries that's gone on to ISO

200224 high value payments in the country.

There's a number of those
there's Australia, Singapore,

So I think most of the large domestic
systems will go on to the ISO 20022

format, which means in some shape and
form, a number of banks in those countries

So we will see more momentum picking
up and more and more banks doing this.

The challenge is on the cross border side.

So in the sense are banks only solving
for this for domestic payments and not

looking at it when they do cross border
which obviously is not what we want.

We want the whole payment landscape
to be moving to the ISO 20022 format.

I think the timeline is I must say,
maybe even looking short, because I know

for a fact in Asia, we have quite a few
countries and banks from those countries

They're using things like
translators and other stopgap

We're seeing progress, but I think it
really needs to pick up in order to

I think on the domestic side, we clearly
see all banks having to play ball and

do that because that's their local
regulator and they need to make it happen.

Yeah on that front as well what
does the shift over to ISO 20022

mean for cross border payments,
do you think, going forward?

As I stated at the outset, I think
the benefits are significant.

FinTech Futures

Expert Insight

At the Sibos 2023 conference in Toronto, FinTech Futures sat down with David Rego, Global Head of Payments at Standard Chartered, to discuss how much progress has been made globally with the switch to ISO 20022 and some of the key benefits of the standard for corporates.